WLP810

Rezzin · Post by **Rezzin** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 12:19 pm

There was a post about this a while back (too bad it's gone) but I'll ask again since I forgot.

I did a Cali Common a while back that took a while to start (as opposed to ale yeast) and I noticed the same thing with this one. I used a 2L starter which I made about a week ago, and after decanting pitched cold into 60d wort. I aerated with O2 for 1 min. I had positive pressure after about 6 hours and as of this morning - it's going pretty slow. Temp has remained steady at 60.

Does lager yeast take longer than ale yeast to 'get going'?

Based on my notes, the beer tasted great after secondary going into the keg. My sanitation is anal so I don't believe it's infection but I remember that I had picked up diaceytel after about a week after kegging. I brought it to Lyn who confirmed my findings. Someone had mentioned 'late bloom' diacetyl and I thought that might have been it but I really wasn't sure.

I found this on another website regarding diacetyl.

How can you tell if the diacetyl rest is complete? There's an easy “forcing” test that will only cost you a few ounces of beer. Pull a sample from your fermenter and split it into two covered containers. Refrigerate one and heat the other to 140°F for an hour, then taste them both. If they taste the same, you're ready to rack your beer out of the fermenter. If you can taste butter in the heated sample, your yeast is still at work, and you should give it another day or two.

I don't think this would apply to me since I did not detect it after secondary but perhaps it was more noticable and I just missed it after carbonation.

So this time around, I'm wondering if a D rest would be beneficial? At 60d, I wouldn't think one would be necessary but if it doesn't hurt, I may try it. I may also try the trick above but this seems to be a chore to have to do each time I brew using lager yeast.

Any thoughts?

brew captain · Post by **brew captain** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 2:43 pm

At 60' you should have nothing to worry about. Just give it a full two weeks in the primary before transferring to secondary and make sure to intentionally take some yeast with you to keep the maturation process going. If your yeast is showing signs of clearing too fast do not be afraid to rouse the yeast during lagering some with a good swirl every other day or so.

Cheers!

backyard brewer · Post by **backyard brewer** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 3:27 pm

IME lager yeasts always take longer to start. 72 hours of lag time is not uncommon for me.

You shouldn't need to do a d-rest with a cali common fermented at 60*, but it couldn't hurt to bounce it up to 68* for 48 hours before lagering it. According to the BJCP , diacetyl is not appropriate to the style.

Rezzin · Post by **Rezzin** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 8:24 pm

Thanks for the reassurance.

So I'm trying to figure out how I picked up the diacetyl flavor AFTER it was kegged. The flavor was non-existent in secondary and overly distracting after it was kegged. Could dirty lines cause that flavor? I thought it was a by product of fermentation. I know for a fact the keg was clean and sanitized very well.

Hopefully I won't have that problem this time... I just remember it tasting awesome at secondary then terrible after kegging. I was slightly bummed to say the least.

backyard brewer · Post by **backyard brewer** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 11:16 pm

dirty lines can contribute all kinds of funk. Maybe it wasn't exactely diacetyl you were tasting?

Rezzin · Post by **Rezzin** » Sun Jan 13, 2008 11:21 pm

Backyard Brewer wrote:dirty lines can contribute all kinds of funk. Maybe it wasn't exactely diacetyl you were tasting?

it was definitely botterscotch-ish in the aroma and flavor. I brought it over to Lyns to sample and he confirmed. The cali common was followed by a pale ale which didn't exhibit any of those flavors but it was pretty hoppy so maybe it masked the off flavors?

I'm not 100% certain it was diacetyl but at the time I did read about late bloom diacetyl so I was convinced it was that. No so much now...

I guess time will tell with this batch. I completely cleaned my kegerator as well as replaced all the tubing so I should be good to go.

Rezzin · Post by **Rezzin** » Sat Jan 26, 2008 2:23 pm

Well I finally racked the common into a keg last night and the sample I had tastes very promising. It's probably not to style but with a little clearing and some CO2, I think it will be a very tasty beer! I did what you recommended Derrin and raised the temp to ~66-68 for the last 3 days just to be on the safe side. Minus being a little yeasty from the transfer, the sample I had tasted pretty clean with no off flavors at all.

I kept the recipe simple this time around so that I can work on understanding what different grain/hop additions can do to a beer. The next time around I'd probably add a little victory and something else to get it a little darker. Other than that, I think I'm pretty happy with my 'coming out of a retirement' brew!

Hmmm... I had problems with a Munich Helles last time, maybe I'll try that again while it's still cold

Rezzin · Post by **Rezzin** » Wed Mar 05, 2008 11:06 pm

Well I'm a firm believer of cold conditioning now. After only 2 weeks of sitting at 31d at Lyns place, the cali common has actually improved significantly. Not a bad beer for only 2 row and C60. I always figured that sitting at serving temps (40-50) for longer would be ok (and maybe it is) but it's pretty amazing what a little cold will do.